Merits for providing education to an associated industry?
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  1. #1
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    Question Merits for providing education to an associated industry?

    Can you get merits for writing an article for another industry's trade magazine or speaking at their conventions?

    For instance, I've spoken at the Association of Bridal Consultants 2009 national convention, the 2011 Wisconsin ABC conference, and wrote a published feature article in the May/June 2011 Wedding Planner Magazine. These are activities for which merits would be received if it was for PPA. But in this case, the education went to an associated industry trade organization.
    Regards,
    Howard Kier, CPP Weddings, ABI, MBA and DAD
    Magical Moments Photography

  2. #2

    Default Re: Merits for providing education to an associated industry?

    Howard pap only gives merits to people who speak at an affiliate event, or for an affiliate association. They cannot issue merits for associations other than themselves or their affilates.
    Jeff
    Jeff Dachowski M.Photog Cr.CPP A.C.ph
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: Merits for providing education to an associated industry?

    That's too bad. Even though speaking to an outside group might not be educating photographers, it is still providing a service to the professional photographic community.
    The same goes for writing and publishing articles in other magazines.
    Regards,
    Howard Kier, CPP Weddings, ABI, MBA and DAD
    Magical Moments Photography

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Merits for providing education to an associated industry?

    This would be a great addition in the ppa, providing credit for giving back to the industry
    Outside of ppa events.
    Suzanne Bird, CPP
    Ontario CPP Liason

    Photography unleashed!
    suebird@urbandogphotog.ca
    613 296 4658

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Merits for providing education to an associated industry?

    Howard & Sue, If that came up in council I would vote against the idea - at least until I heard in in depth discussion of how it would be policed. The degree system has already been extremely diluted with all the merits for webinars, Super Mondays, continuing education etc etc. So now we are going to let somebody stand up for 15 minutes at their local Kiwanis club and talk about how to clean your camera and get a PPA merit for it? I realize the programs Howard presented were way more effort and in depth then that, but once you open the door, who is gonna say what outside groups are merit worthy and what is not? There are plenty of opportunities to earn merits presenting programs for PPA affiliates. We don't need to make it easier. Charity begins at home.

    Keith
    Keith A. Howe
    M.Photog.,M.Artist, Cr.,D.F.Ph.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Merits for providing education to an associated industry?

    Keith,

    First and foremost, please understand I didn't suggest merits for a Kiwanis club. I'm talking about related industry's trade associations. For instance, a wedding photographer can speak at an Association of Bridal Consultants conference or retreat. Now that you mention it, I do understand the slippery slope you're on. But OTOH, I actually receive ABC education credits for documented attendance at PPA meetings and conventions. The key is being documented and verifiable. Perhaps if the speaker were required to provide a copy of the program, their presentation and a contact, PPA could be assured the speaker actually spoke as they claimed.

    Writing and publishing an article in an industry's trade magazine would be much easier to manage. Just provide a copy of the magazine/article to PPA.

    I beginning to believe we reward those who speak and teach other photographers. That's great but that just creates speakers within our industry. It does nothing to educate those in other industries which are associated with photographers. We complain the general public does not appreciate good photography yet we do very little to provide positive public relations. As a trade association, we should be doing more to provide a more positive image of our industry. Part of the way we do that is by working with other trade groups such as ABC.
    Regards,
    Howard Kier, CPP Weddings, ABI, MBA and DAD
    Magical Moments Photography

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Merits for providing education to an associated industry?

    Agree, it would be harder to police.

    I think Howard's concept of trade publications is an interesting one (tear sheets are easy to send in) and limiting potential outside merits to college photography programs and other professional photography associations? Possibly help international members have some options to gather some merits by acknowledging their active role in giving back where they live.

    Any time we can have a professionally recognized Photographer be in front of a forum I think is great. Helps create more awareness for general public purchasing photography and people seeking to enter the profession.
    Suzanne Bird, CPP
    Ontario CPP Liason

    Photography unleashed!
    suebird@urbandogphotog.ca
    613 296 4658

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Merits for providing education to an associated industry?

    I agree with Keith, although merits for speaking at WPPI would be compelling, it would be hard to delineate the difference between wedding consultants and Kiwanis. It should be our general duty to educate the public because the reward is the "green merit". I lecture to outside the profession to strengthen my business not to offer trade secrets that I can do within our association.

    I beginning to believe we reward those who speak and teach other photographers. That's great but that just creates speakers within our industry.
    I strongly disagree. When I teach to our profession, I teach what I learn from outside of the industry. Many of our outstanding speakers share what they've learned from outside the profession as well. For example, the concept of experiential marketing did not come from within our association.
    Michael Gan,M.Photog.Cr. CPP,
    Meritage House of Photography

    If your business depends on you, you don't own a business-you have a job. And it's the worst job in the world because you're working for a lunatic... You can't close it when you want to, because if it's closed you don't get paid. You can't leave it when you want to, because if you leave there's nobody there to do the work. You can't sell it when you want to, because who wants to buy a job?
    —Michael Gerber
    http://www.meritageonmain.blogspot.com

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Merits for providing education to an associated industry?

    Michael,

    I have to disagree with you. It is easy to distinguish between social, charitable and professional groups. A quick look at the mission statement tells you a lot about the group. To say you can't tell the difference between Kiwanis and Bridal consultants is a slap in the face of those hard working bridal consultants. Just as we say professional photographers continue to learn their craft, have a high level of proficiency, can provide predictable results upon demand and get paid for what they do, the same can be said of other professions. When those criteria are met, the group is a professional trade organization. ABC members would meet the definition of being a professional but not a Kiwanis.

    I could never understand why I couldn't get CEU's or merits for attending WPPI when one year a speaker would be at image and then next they were at WPPI. To make matter worse, they hadn't really changed their presentation. I know it is a slippery slope. Personally, it is frustrating to need one speaker merit and not be able to get credit for speaking to outside groups. But life is not black and white, it is shades of gray.

    While I appreciate the support, I would not want to limit this to just other photography organizations. Perhaps rather than make a blanket statement as to which organizations where we'd allow merits to be earned, it could be on a case by case basis. The rules would be:

    • Industry which regularly interacts with photographers (ie. Wedding coordinators, magazine publishers)
    • Professional trade organization or association
    • National and/or State (where state chapters exist) level conventions
    • National and/or state (where state chapters exist) member publications
    • Members generally fulfill the 4 criteria for being a professional (high level of competence, predictable results, continuing education, get paid)

    Using these criteria, we can effectively, differentiate between another professional group and a social/charitable one. A member can propose a group be added. It will be evaluated to determine if it meets the criteria. Once the group is on the list, speaking or writing for that association would earn merits.
    Regards,
    Howard Kier, CPP Weddings, ABI, MBA and DAD
    Magical Moments Photography

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Merits for providing education to an associated industry?

    Well, I guess we can agree to disagree. I just don't see why it's important for PPA to educate other organizations for their improvement. What have they done to help improve our profession? Why should we be the educational source for bridal consultants? How would that be fair to our portrait and commercial members? How does educating other trade associations benefit the members of PPA?

    PPA gets enough flak for educating photographers who are non-members as it is. We just can't be responsible for helping out other trade associations when we have 22,000 members to serve and educate. Educating other trade associations are far from our association's mission and vision.
    Last edited by Michael_Gan; 05-05-2011 at 11:44 PM.
    Michael Gan,M.Photog.Cr. CPP,
    Meritage House of Photography

    If your business depends on you, you don't own a business-you have a job. And it's the worst job in the world because you're working for a lunatic... You can't close it when you want to, because if it's closed you don't get paid. You can't leave it when you want to, because if you leave there's nobody there to do the work. You can't sell it when you want to, because who wants to buy a job?
    —Michael Gerber
    http://www.meritageonmain.blogspot.com

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