Photographic Craftsman ... too easy to get? - Page 3
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  1. #21

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    I got my craftsman in 2005 and then got my API just last year.

    I have also heard that it is now easier to get both.

    But, I have also found that those who have gone before us almost always feel that it was a lot more difficult to get something back in "The Day"

    I was a very young E-6 in the Navy and I always heard that it was easier to become an E-6 in 1982 than it was to become one "Back In" 1962. Just to clarify I was young age wise but it took me 6 years to get to E-6 just like it took the person complaining, I just enlisted 6 years earlier than they did.

    I usually just respond (if it is someone that I know) " Well I used to walk 3 miles in 4 feet of snow with no shoes to get to school and................."

  2. #22

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    I've always heard it was the process of getting the degree, not the degree itself.
    It's the journey, not the destination.

    And if it's so easy, go for it and tell us today just how easy it is.
    If someone can get their degree "fast" (it still takes time and work) than you deserve it.

    I'm sorry, but PPA is an association of inclusion, not exclusion.
    In the long run, that's better for us as an industry and as individuals.

    And remember, Affiliates are not "local" PPA associations. They are affiliated, independent associations, with their own governance, rules, and customs. PPA has no control over them. All we do is handle merits and the rules to earning merits.

  3. #23

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    A few years ago we had a new member show up at our guild meeting. She asked all sorts of questions. One was "What do you do for business during the slow months?" A couple of photographers gave her specific examples. She then went after those accounts and did whatever it took to get them.

    Something then hit the fan. The two photographers that shared were outraged. We all learned a valuable lesson.

    So many new ones show up and no NOTHING about photography. How can you explain cool advanced techniques in Adobe Photoshop to someone who doesn't understand what a good exposure looks like, who doesn't know the difference between raw and jpg, who doesn't understand that you need to charge more than 99 cents, who thinks we should hold their hand and solve their problems without putting forth any effort to figure it out for themselves.

    I'm a big one for wanting people to "pay their dues" by struggling a little on their own. It could be through apprenticeship or college, but you have to put forth time, energy and money to learn basic concepts. There is no such thing as an overnight success in photography. You have to lay a sound foundation.

    I really want to go to programs to be inspired to do greater things. It means that I need to get off my rear and put in time, energy and money to get better myself. It does mean I may have to travel to do it.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Normal, Illinois
    Posts
    7,783

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    Make the apprentices pay more for membership and make them work hard for active membership. Our apprentice (some groups call them "aspiring") pay $50 more for membership and they must attend a "Business 101" 2 day course, submit an ongoing portfolio of their work, volunteer for at least three committees, and get their business licenses within a year (or be dropped from membership). We limit this to 20% of the membership, so now there's a waiting list to get in. This 20% rule keeps our association from being a "camera club".
    Now, Michael, you and others have pointed out this problem with what is essentially a lack of old-style apprenticeship, and a philosophical problem with "charging while learning," but I'm not seeing where this satisfactorily answers either problem.

    Are you presuming that this "apprentice" is working for another photograher, or is he doing something else as his "day job?" Or do you expect him to be a student--and if so, what about the person starting as a second career who has a mortgage and a kid in high school?

    If the apprentice must have his business license within a year, then does your program ensure that (presuming he adheres to it) he will be adequately salable by that time?

    What is the encouragement--the obvious benefit to a photographer to engage this program. I understand--viewing it from the inside--what the benefit is. But for that MWAC who has the potential of being Suzanne Maitland, what is the benefit of making the front door hard to push open?

    Notice that it's easy to enlist into the Marine Corps....
    --Elephants can swim...
    ...and very gracefully.
    Knowing that,
    I do believe
    Anything is possible for me.

    Kirk Darling, CPP

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    San Diego, Calif
    Posts
    5,846

    Default well....

    "you and others have pointed out this problem with what is essentially a lack of old-style apprenticeship,"

    I'm not sure it's really that hard to find.....I've had a number of apprentices over the years, and have one working with me right now. It might be that some folks think they don't need to learn from someone, they can take a course in hs or college and be ready to go. I've yet to see anyone ready to go to work from taking those classes.....I've seen too many resumes of people that "graduated" from a jc photo program, listing their darkroom (chemical) skills, their ability to photograph flowers and old buildings, and their knowledge of ps 3 as making them ready to be a fulltime photog.....folks can find an apprentice position if they live anywhere near a metro area....they just have to be willing to put in the time and be willing to learn.....

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Normal, Illinois
    Posts
    7,783

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    folks can find an apprentice position if they live anywhere near a metro area....they just have to be willing to put in the time and be willing to learn.....
    "...and if so, what about the person starting as a second career who has a mortgage and a kid in high school?"
    --Elephants can swim...
    ...and very gracefully.
    Knowing that,
    I do believe
    Anything is possible for me.

    Kirk Darling, CPP

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    San Diego, Calif
    Posts
    5,846

    Default well....

    ""...and if so, what about the person starting as a second career who has a mortgage and a kid in high school?""

    Funny you should mention that.....I was working for a studio (Ed Booth) during the day, then changing clothes in the car on the way to my gig that night. Did that for about a year.....yeah, had two youngins at the time, made the most of the time we did have, sundays and a couple of evenings. If I could do it, I'd guess a lot of folks could.....if you want something, set a goal and accomplish that goal. I never said it was easy, it is very do-able....

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Fort Worth, Texas
    Posts
    1,789

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Stan Lawrence View Post
    ""...and if so, what about the person starting as a second career who has a mortgage and a kid in high school?""

    Funny you should mention that.....I was working for a studio (Ed Booth) during the day, then changing clothes in the car on the way to my gig that night. Did that for about a year.....yeah, had two youngins at the time, made the most of the time we did have, sundays and a couple of evenings. If I could do it, I'd guess a lot of folks could.....if you want something, set a goal and accomplish that goal. I never said it was easy, it is very do-able....
    That describe the double life I led for 25 years. Worked for a major Aerospace company during the days and spent evenings and weekends on photography. Only after retiring a year ago from my "day job" did I get down to just one job...photography.
    ____________________
    Dave Cisco M.Photog, Cr., CPP, F-TPPA

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Hudson, NH
    Posts
    6,047

    Default

    "...and if so, what about the person starting as a second career who has a mortgage and a kid in high school?"
    We do it as time allows. And spend every spare minute learning, so when we make the leap, we are confident in our abilities to prosper. It sure takes a lot more time this way, I'll tell you, but with a "lifestyle" to support and a kid in college, it is what it is.
    Mark Levesque, CPP, M. Photog., Cr. Photog, A.C. Ph., CPP Liaison, PPCC Judge

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Normal, Illinois
    Posts
    7,783

    Default

    That describe the double life I led for 25 years. Worked for a major Aerospace company during the days and spent evenings and weekends on photography. Only after retiring a year ago from my "day job" did I get down to just one job...photography.
    Dave, were you apprenticed to a master photographer during any of that time?
    --Elephants can swim...
    ...and very gracefully.
    Knowing that,
    I do believe
    Anything is possible for me.

    Kirk Darling, CPP

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