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View Full Version : 2nd Possible Competition Print.....



Julie_DeGuia
01-08-2008, 03:43 PM
Here is another I would appreciate comment on.

Title, maybe just "Expecting"

Thanks very much,
Julie

http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee161/jdgphotography/Forum%20Sharing/PregnantCompetition-resize.jpg?t=1199810527

D._Craig_Flory
01-08-2008, 04:01 PM
Hi Julie ;

This I absolutely love ! The placement isn't on one of the quadrants but is a candidate for using the Bakker Saddle instead which you have done. The only (minor) thing I'd change is to slightly lighten the bottom hand ... but not enough to start drawing attention to it.

If this came up while I was judging I'd give it at least an 82.

Nylora_Bruleigh
01-08-2008, 04:05 PM
HI Julie!

First I would like to say that I am not a judge.

With that being said I think you executed this image well. The lighting looks great with the detail in the shirt, the crop is great, the color looks great.

The only problem that I think you will have with this image is that it has been done 100 times. Prenatal portraits aren't "new" anymore so you really have to do something "different" to get the judges attention. Do you have others from the same session that are "out of the ordinary" or "UNexpected"? (not pun intended!)

Also, if you do find an image you may want the title to be a play on words, again to get the attention of the judges.

Nylora

Stan_Lawrence
01-08-2008, 05:26 PM
"The only problem that I think you will have with this image is that it has been done 100 times."

That isn't always a negative...I had a print score 86 at regionals a few years ago, the score was challenged. The low judge said "it's been done before", the high judge said " yea, look how well he did it".....it stayed at 86. If it's done well, it can still hang. :cool:

D._Craig_Flory
01-08-2008, 05:36 PM
Hi Stan;

That's why I said I'd score it at least an 82. Instead of the tummy being blown out ... there is a nice range of tones from highlights, with detail, to the shadows.

Nylora_Bruleigh
01-08-2008, 05:48 PM
Stan,

Point well taken. And, like I said, I think this one IS done well.

So, Good Luck Julie and let us know what happens! :D

Nylora

Dave_Cisco
01-08-2008, 06:48 PM
Instead of the tummy being blown out ... there is a nice range of tones from highlights, with detail, to the shadows.


Interesting play on words......:D

Might try "New Beginning".

It's different, but the black was my first concern. Maybe that in itself will make it more interesting. Just be sure that you keep detail in the highlights.

Don_Chick
01-08-2008, 09:27 PM
Even though this topic has been done many times, this is a well done image..... You have a nice quality of light on the image, clothing/background are done very well. My biggest concern is the light falloff on the thumb at the bottom of the image. On this small print it appears to kinda float in space... If you have an great title and excellent print quality, I could see it meriting....

Auralee_Dallas
01-09-2008, 12:16 AM
What a bummer, I can't see the image. Did you take it down?

Julie_DeGuia
01-09-2008, 02:46 AM
Auralee... the image is still there.

Thanks for the positive comments on this image! I have done this pose several times since I took this one in March and haven't been able to get the lighting quite as nice.... which is why I keep coming back to this one.

Craig, can you please explain your quadrant comment? Bakker Saddle? This image was originally taken the opposite direction and I flipped it. I couldn't get the belly button out of the center of the image though. Should I try to elongate the image before dropping it onto the canvas?

Don, why do you say the black was a concern?

Thanks very much,
Julie

D._Craig_Flory
01-09-2008, 12:55 PM
What a bummer, I can't see the image. Did you take it down?

Hi Auralee;

If you took off those dark star glasses you could see the image. :D

D._Craig_Flory
01-09-2008, 01:02 PM
Auralee... the image is still there.

Thanks for the positive comments on this image! I have done this pose several times since I took this one in March and haven't been able to get the lighting quite as nice.... which is why I keep coming back to this one.

Craig, can you please explain your quadrant comment? Bakker Saddle? This image was originally taken the opposite direction and I flipped it. I couldn't get the belly button out of the center of the image though. Should I try to elongate the image before dropping it onto the canvas?

Don, why do you say the black was a concern?

Thanks very much,
Julie

Hi Julie;

I'm posting my lesson on rule of thirds uisng a composition grid and using the Bakker Saddle. You can also access a grid in Photoshop for rule of thirds but I sometimes like a grid on a separate layer so I can lower the opacity to see the image better. I'll check later to see what questions you may have. Oh, when I posted this a year or two ago lots of people sent me an e-mail asking to have me send them my grid and bakker saddle which I gladly did.

Don_Chick
01-09-2008, 02:12 PM
Don, why do you say the black was a concern?

Thanks very much,
Julie

Julie,

I think you meant Dave - for the "black" comment.....

My concern is the thumb. If you can make it so it's a subordinate element of the composition without it appearing to "float" in space. If possible have it attached to the rest of the hand/arm.

Again, Nice image!

Dave_Cisco
01-09-2008, 04:12 PM
Don, why do you say the black was a concern?

Thanks very much,
Julie

I assume you meant me..:)

Black was a concern because it is usually associated with the end of life rather than the beginning. Usually, "preggos" are high-key, light, fluffy...
The style of her top helps dull the "darkness" of the image...it looks fresh/stylish.

Linda_Gregory
01-10-2008, 01:02 PM
I'd use a title to play on her goosebumps. THAT would set it off from the other belly shots. "Only Cold on the Outside" "Goosebumps of Expectations"

Holly, where are you??

Julie_DeGuia
01-10-2008, 03:03 PM
Linda - That is funny you mentioned goosebumps, I was going to put something like that up today and see what everyone thought! Thanks for the ideas.

Don - I see what you are saying and I am not sure I have enough information in that area to make the thumb and arm connect. By the way, I have the 2006 Showcase book and went looking through it the other night (for all the pregnancy merits) and came across your image! I hope to be in one of the books, someday.......

Dave - Thanks for clarifying. I can see that black might be associated with death, but I have always associated it with class/elegance... as in b&w prints. I just pulled out my notes form a Jane Conner-Ziser seminar and she has black as "dramatic and can also mean death." I guess I was going for dramatic!! :-)

And Craig - Thanks for the info. I am still not sure I understand the Bakker's Saddle. Maybe the template would help me see it. I will pm you later.

Julie

Cheri_MacCallum
01-10-2008, 03:12 PM
I agree about the bottom hand, because of the vignetting the bottom hand has gone gray. Lighten the hand just a little and warm it up just a tad!

Dave_Cisco
01-10-2008, 03:20 PM
And Craig - Thanks for the info. I am still not sure I understand the Bakker's Saddle. Maybe the template would help me see it. I will pm you later.

Julie

Might Google Bakker Saddle.:)

D._Craig_Flory
01-10-2008, 03:30 PM
Linda - That is funny you mentioned goosebumps, I was going to put something like that up today and see what everyone thought! Thanks for the ideas.

Don - I see what you are saying and I am not sure I have enough information in that area to make the thumb and arm connect. By the way, I have the 2006 Showcase book and went looking through it the other night (for all the pregnancy merits) and came across your image! I hope to be in one of the books, someday.......

Dave - Thanks for clarifying. I can see that black might be associated with death, but I have always associated it with class/elegance... as in b&w prints. I just pulled out my notes form a Jane Conner-Ziser seminar and she has black as "dramatic and can also mean death." I guess I was going for dramatic!! :-)

And Craig - Thanks for the info. I am still not sure I understand the Bakker's Saddle. Maybe the template would help me see it. I will pm you later.

Julie

Hi Julie;

I made an example for you showing the Bakker Saddle on top. You put the long line across and then the short line goes from the corner of the presentation matte to the long line at a 45ยบ angle. Both lines are separate. You can change the size of it as well as changing the line's color too. I'm posting my example with the saddle lowered in opacity so you can see the senior image better while still seeing the bakker saddle.

My composition grid doesn't work for all images. Sometimes a placement, other than on one of the golden mean points, works better. I hope this helps.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i93/DC47/BakkerSaddleExample-1.jpg

Cheri_MacCallum
01-10-2008, 03:37 PM
Robert Symms taught me about Bakker's Saddle years ago. It can come in handy when other rules of composition don't really work

D._Craig_Flory
01-10-2008, 03:52 PM
For those that don't know ... Gerhard Bakker was an incredible photographer. There is a PPA award named after him. Here is an article about it being awarded to Frank Chricchio. I was lucky enough to take a week long advanced portrait class with him in 1990. I think it's appropriate to have Frank win it since I think he has more merits than any living photographer and Gerhard used to hold that distinction. http://prophoto.typepad.com/prophoto/2007/11/index.html

Rick_Massarini
01-11-2008, 04:48 AM
The Gerhard Bakker Award was presented this year to Hanson Fong, not to Frank Cricchio. Frank was awarded the PPA Lifetime Achievement Award this year.

Frank received the Gerhard Bakker Award in 1992 - the third time it was given. The Award is limited to 25 recipients and Hanson was the 19th recipient.

And - while I'm listing award recipients, The PPA Director's Award was presented this year to Terry Deglau and to Buddy Stewart. - two of the most deserving people in this, and the next, world.

D._Craig_Flory
01-11-2008, 01:10 PM
The Gerhard Bakker Award was presented this year to Hanson Fong, not to Frank Cricchio. Frank was awarded the PPA Lifetime Achievement Award this year.

Frank received the Gerhard Bakker Award in 1992 - the third time it was given. The Award is limited to 25 recipients and Hanson was the 19th recipient.

And - while I'm listing award recipients, The PPA Director's Award was presented this year to Terry Deglau and to Buddy Stewart. - two of the most deserving people in this, and the next, world.

I definitely know Terry Deglau. He was President of PPAofPa in 1971.

Don_Chick
01-11-2008, 01:25 PM
By the way, I have the 2006 Showcase book and went looking through it the other night (for all the pregnancy merits) and came across your image! I hope to be in one of the books, someday.......

Julie

Julie,

Set your goal for the Loan book! Getting in the Showcase book means that a judge at National wanted the image to go "Loan" but not enough judges on the panel agreed.

Steve_Bedell
01-11-2008, 05:08 PM
Hi Julie,
I don't show up here very often but I'd like to make a few comments about your image. First, it's quite beautiful and the light is very well handled and the dark is very effective for the drama. The point Nylora made about the photo being done before is well taken. To have a pose or image that is being 'seen a lot' you must do something to elevate yours above the norm. I don't think you've quite done that here. While the light is nice, no one has talked about the top hand which could be more graceful. Also, you said you 'flipped' the image, would those rings go on the right hand when they're really on the left? Can't tell with this size image.
Taken together, I think these issues would keep this out of merit range. Very close though!

D._Craig_Flory
01-11-2008, 05:50 PM
Hi Steve;

It's nice to see you pop in here. As an example, for her, of a different treatment that would break the mold ... she could have done the session, outdoors, in a private secluded spot. The surroundings would have helped tell the story. I have seen a lot of expectant Mom images, like hers, but far fewer outdoors. That would have been the unique factor to get the panel enthused. Am I on the right path to creating an expectant Mom image that would still get the judges sitting up and taking notice ?

Steve_Bedell
01-11-2008, 08:00 PM
Craig, you cite several factors that may be of benefit but it all comes down to creating an image that will stand out among other similar ones.

Keith_A_Howe
01-11-2008, 08:26 PM
D. Craig, using the scene you suggest could work, if a different story is being illustrated. In this particular image it's all about shape and form, the curve of the belly. To place that curve in an outdoor environment would do nothing to enhance the story. If the story was all about fertility and the abundance of nature, trying to relate an expectant mother producing a child with "Mother Nature" say producing a harvest, then an outdoor location like in a wheat field ready for harvest or a blooming garden would add to the story. Placing a subject in a different location, just for the sake of being unique, is not a good idea. Placing a subject in a different location for the sake of creating a unique and believable story is a great idea.

Keith

Julie_DeGuia
01-11-2008, 09:22 PM
Thanks again for all the feedback.

Steve, you bring up two good points. The first, about the hand not being graceful.... I had noticed that myself. Her hand is not perfectly curved and there is one finger (the middle finger) not getting as much light as the others. Also, maybe due to "bloating" of certain areas of the body during pregnancy, her fingers are not as slender as they might be otherwise.... not sure what could be done about that. The other point about the rings being on the "wrong" hand after flipping the image I had not thought about but you are correct. They are wedding rings.

I will go back and see if any of the other frames under the same lighting conditions are better.

Julie

Steve_Bedell
01-12-2008, 12:02 AM
Julie, I look forward to seeing more of your beautiful work!

Julie_DeGuia
01-22-2008, 05:23 AM
First, thanks Steve!

I have reworked this image some. I cloned out the wedding ring so that it isn't yelling "I was flipped!" I dodged the left hand and sleeve just a bit... too much and it looked icky.

Any better? I will enter it either way... I don't think there is much more I can do to improve this image as is, but I am always open to suggenstions!

Title... just "Goosebumps"

Thanks,
Julie

http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee161/jdgphotography/Forum%20Sharing/PregnantCompetition2-resize.jpg?t=1200982655

Linda_Gregory
01-22-2008, 11:47 AM
Julie,

I redid the hand a bit, I hope you don't mind. I lengthened the fingers just slightly and narrowed the hand, then darkened and smoothed the joints slightly. I found my eyes were being pulled back to her hand joints too much.

http://www.lindagregory.com/juliedeguia.jpg

Julie_DeGuia
01-22-2008, 02:52 PM
Linda - I don't mind. I have been distracted by her knuckles as well so it is nice to see a comparison.

Julie

D._Craig_Flory
01-22-2008, 03:01 PM
Hi Julie;

Imagine you are a judge on a print competition panel. You hear the title "Goosebumps". Then the image appears and everyone has a blank expression trying to relate the title to the image. I would not reward a maker for a title like that.

I feel that you need a one word, or short, title that relates to her bringing a new life into the world.

Linda_Gregory
01-22-2008, 03:21 PM
I'm not a judge but I like the name. She looks like there's goosebumps and I get goosebumps thinking of new life.

It'd be interesting to hear from others on this concept.

D._Craig_Flory
01-22-2008, 03:34 PM
As I work I've been thinking about this image. Here are a few I thought of:

"Almost There" , Nature's Way", "Growing", "Evolving", "Transition", "Changes",
"A New Beginning".

Julie_DeGuia
01-22-2008, 03:47 PM
Thanks Craig... much appreciated. I think I like "Almost There" the best of the ones you posted.

Julie

Don_Chick
01-22-2008, 04:24 PM
Interesting to have a Woman and Mans perspective on the title...

The best advice I ever received on how to title an image was from Darton Drake.

"Capture the emotion of the image in the title"
Sometimes its one word sometimes several.

Just make sure whatever title you choose will fit in all the little boxes they give you on the entry form!!! :eek:

Heather_L._Smith
01-22-2008, 05:06 PM
Okay, this may be totally stupid, but what about "Filling the Void" ?

It speaks to the new life AND the surrounding darkness of the image.