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Lori_Clapp
01-18-2007, 04:59 AM
I know you guys are probably getting sick of me....I'm even getting sick of myself!

Can you tell it's almost time for our convention? And I'm entering for the first time??

If anyone is still reading, please give me your opinions on these, and if you think I should enter them, any title recommendations?

Thank you!!

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g6/amitphotos/gbreadhouse.jpg
Title...Gingerbread house....maybe?

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g6/amitphotos/chris.jpg
Original image and.....

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g6/amitphotos/Chrisrev.jpg flipped. Possible title...."Catch of the Day"?

and last....(for now)....
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g6/amitphotos/Bush.jpg

Sorry, I realize this gets old when there are only 4 of us on the forum, and one of us is taking up all the posts....

Zack_Davis
01-18-2007, 09:55 AM
What do you mean Lori... only four of you guys on the forum. It looked to me like you were going crazy in the Hilton bar especially after you met Jack... you were so excited I thought you were going to faint :D

Lori_Clapp
01-18-2007, 01:44 PM
What do you mean Lori... only four of you guys on the forum. It looked to me like you were going crazy in the Hilton bar especially after you met Jack... you were so excited I thought you were going to faint :D

Oh great - I knew I would emberass myself. Why did you let me drink so much?

D._Craig_Flory
01-18-2007, 02:18 PM
Hi Lori;

I study them more and make comments later this morning.

So ... inquiring minds want to know ... what is her drink of choice? I'm guessing boilermakers. LOL

Lori_Clapp
01-18-2007, 03:11 PM
Hi Lori;

I study them more and make comments later this morning.

So ... inquiring minds want to know ... what is her drink of choice? I'm guessing boilermakers. LOL

I'm wondering that too - I usually stick to beer, but it sounds like I got out of hand!

Thanks for looking at these - people seem to be having a hard time getting critiques lately - maybe because people aren't back from IUSA. Anyway, I appreciate your input!

D._Craig_Flory
01-18-2007, 03:27 PM
Hi Lori;

I'm going with the little young lady first. Write this down, type it up, make a big sign for the camera room: "kids need room to grow" ! I like the image but it is way too close. Judges will normally slam you for images of kids (or puppies and kittens) done too close. Here is my version ... I hope it gives you some ideas on presentation. I'll post about the others later.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i93/DC47/BushEnhanced.jpg

D._Craig_Flory
01-18-2007, 03:46 PM
Hi Lori;

I didn't much care for the football image till I played with it in Photoshop. I fixed the erasure problem around his one arm and then artistically worked it till I liked it. I hope you like it too and get some ideas from it.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i93/DC47/ChrisrevEnhanced.jpg

D._Craig_Flory
01-18-2007, 04:11 PM
Hi Lori;

Here is the House ... done my way. I painted it a touch in Corel Painter Essentials as well as using the smudge tool in Photoshop.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i93/DC47/gbreadhouseEnhanced.jpg

Will_Price
01-18-2007, 04:20 PM
I think Lori probably shoots more for green merits from the Mom instead of competition... I usually frame up a few in thirds for me, and the rest for Mom. If I had a nickel for every time a Mom said, "Gee I like that one, but could you crop it closer???"

Lori_Clapp
01-19-2007, 04:20 AM
Craig, Thank you for the ideas, and for taking the time to look at these. I really like what you did with the house! Okay, I still have a question though - what do you think of them for competition? Would you enter them or should I keep looking? I have others I am considering - and it totally will not hurt my feelings if you just tell me they aren't worth entering.

Thanks again!

Will - you are right - I shoot for what I would want to buy - not because I'm necessarily looking for green merits, which are always nice, but becaue I shoot what I like - I've never thought about competition before - maybe once I do, I will think differently in my sessions....we'll see!

Jeff_Dachowski
01-19-2007, 04:39 AM
Lori,
I haven't looked but for a second, and my first impression is that the football payers arems are scrawny. They appear too thin. Can you boost them up a bit?
Jeff

Lori_Clapp
01-19-2007, 04:41 AM
Lori,
I haven't looked but for a second, and my first impression is that the football payers arems are scrawny. They appear too thin. Can you boost them up a bit?
Jeff

I've been trying for 15 years - he's my scrawny son! Lol.

Jeff_Dachowski
01-19-2007, 04:47 AM
a pound of hot wings and a two liter of diet coke goes a long way towards that goal!
Jeff

Lori_Clapp
01-19-2007, 05:02 AM
a pound of hot wings and a two liter of diet coke goes a long way towards that goal!
Jeff

I eat and drink that every night - his arms haven't grown a bit! Maybe I should add chocolate cake to my diet - or did you mean that HE should try it?

Kelly_Michelle
01-19-2007, 05:46 AM
Hi Lori -

I know absolutely nothing about competion so please take this for what it's worth -

regarding the football catch: I really like the first one best. I think the partial silloutte is neat. I am not sure about judging but I think it tells a story.

I am enjoying gleaning all the info off these threads you have started. Some really great info for making an image better!

Kelly

D._Craig_Flory
01-19-2007, 01:58 PM
Hi Lori;

There are lots of images not entered because the maker didn't have the vision to make final print presentations competition ready. I hope what I did helps, in that way, ... to always look at other ways to work them.

When I'm working on competition images I save lots of versions. I e-mail low-res to Masters friends for critiques and suggestions. I also sound possible titles off of them.

Please do post more images. Then the group can determine the four with the best chances.

Lori_Clapp
01-19-2007, 02:00 PM
Thanks Craig - I will post some more today. Just didn't want to hog all the critiques for myself!

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-19-2007, 04:09 PM
are learning from your willingness to brave the critiques!!!! :)

D._Craig_Flory
01-19-2007, 04:23 PM
are learning from your willingness to brave the critiques!!!! :)

Hi Sue Ellen;

Rather than sit back and let only Lori be brave, how about posting some of yours ?

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-19-2007, 06:22 PM
Hi Sue Ellen;

Rather than sit back and let only Lori be brave, how about posting some of yours ?

I guess I asked for that, didn't I...

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-19-2007, 06:40 PM
...wades in...

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-19-2007, 07:27 PM
this water is a bit deeper...

D._Craig_Flory
01-19-2007, 07:55 PM
Hi Sue Ellen;

On this image you have the subject layer positioned so she is on the 4th quadrant. Since we read left to right, that means she is already on the side our eyes exit from. Also, I'm curious where you selected the color for the backgrd. layer ? Here is my version .... with her on the 1st quadrant and with a bkgrd. layer made from selected colors of her outfit.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i93/DC47/ChristianaCPEnhanced.jpg

D._Craig_Flory
01-19-2007, 08:20 PM
Hi Sue Ellen;

I worked on your bridge image and here is my version:

One comment is this ... the black bkgrd. layer is fine, for fine art, but I would go with cool tones from the water. Also, this image has no focal point. In mine I added a boat and positioned the subject layer so that the boat ended up on the 4th quadrant facing left and back into the image. I deepened the image also.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i93/DC47/kate20shelley20bridgeEnhanced.jpg

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-20-2007, 01:26 AM
(and Lori...you can kick me outa here any time...)

Craig - in "The Big Picture" the mat color is drawn from the iris of her eye, and the thin line is from the near-white of her eye. I specifically wanted to avoid using color from her garment for a variety of reasons. This is a large teen and I wanted to focus on the beauty of her face...hence the choice of mat. I positioned it as if she were inside the box looking out.

Re "Kate Shelley Bridge" - I did dabble with using a water tone for the mat; to me it's a tossup. I understand the difficulty in this image of not having one focal point but I don't like the boat...it distracts from the bridge and is inconsistent with boats that might really be found there. It also looks a little large in proportion...the river really isn't that deep there.

Questions:

How did you deepen the 2nd image? (I can't really see it from this size)

How about coloring one of the train cars and its reflection...would that create an acceptable focal point?

You don't say how strong or weak these images are in terms of competition. As a first timer I expect to learn a lot. How far away from merit do you think these are?

Holly_Howe
01-20-2007, 02:49 AM
Sue Ellen - When D. Craig made the mat color similar to her clothes - it left the face as the only brown thing in the image - so it pops out more. When the face and the background mat are the same color as you showed- then the red clothing is the unique color element and it stands out. So D. Craig's mat color was a better choice IMO. However changing the mat color is not enough to make this a merit image. I believe it would be very difficult to get to an 80 with this image because of several other issues. You mentioned that she is a big girl, and this particular pose emphasizes that. There is nothing wrong with being any size - but just as you would not enhance a very thin person (like me - yeah right!) by posing them to make them look even thinner, you don't want to make a larger person look even larger. Also on a heavy person - broad lighting as you have here is not the best choice. Next her glasses frames intersect her eyes. IMO again - it's an uncomfortable look and distracts from her eyes. Her expression is blank - not thought provoking. It needs to be a little more intense - if you know what I mean by that. Chopping off the tip of her finger and the bottom edge of the hand is usually not a good idea. These are all little things - easily fixed on the next session. But the biggest thing that hit me when I first saw this image is the effect you used - Lucius maybe? hard to tell for sure here. You said "I wanted to focus on the beauty of her face" so what led you to add an effect that makes her look like she has a 5:00 shadow? Instead of emphazing the beauty of a curving cheek or smooth skin - this effect makes her face look dirty. I looked twice to be sure it was a woman and not a man. I am harping on this point - not to scold you - but because others will read this. Too many times people add filters or effects to an image for competition and don't think about whether it enhances and perpetuates the story of the image or if it's just because you have it available to use. Keith said he would score this image just into the average catergory.

Next the bridge. As you presented it - there is no center of interest. So D. Craig added a boat. Granted it is a little bright but at least it gives you somewhere for your eyes to rest. Without it you come in on one side of the image and the bridge takes you right out the other side. If you follow the river back - it just leads you nowhere - there is nothing of interest to keep your eyes - just out of focus trees. You commented to D. Craig that you didn't like the boat because "it distracts from the bridge and is inconsistent with boats that might really be found there" First - how is a judge gonna know what kind of boats are usually on that river? Next - it does detract from the bridge - but that's the whole point. The bridge is not a good center of interest - it's basically a horizontal line through the image. The other challenge with the bridge is it was taken at the wrong time of day. Go back in the early morning or late afternoon so the light skims across the scene. Get one of your grandkids ( if they are old enough) out in the river, floating in an inner tube, wearing a bright red swimsuit. Or fishing on that log that's jutting into the river - wearing a bright warm solid color to pop out from the grays and blues of the background. - Then you will have something. We felt this image would be borderline in making it into the average catergory.

Holly

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-20-2007, 05:05 AM
an effect that makes her look like she has a 5:00 shadow?

Having not posted the original to compare, you wouldn't know this...but the effect actually softens the shadow. I know the area could be lightened, but I tend to work toward reflecting the genuine more than the glam.


challenge with the bridge is it was taken at the wrong time of day. Go back in the early morning Well, it was 8:14 a.m. But the day was already bright.

Thanks for your other comments.

Dave_Cisco
01-20-2007, 05:25 AM
I know the area could be lightened, but I tend to work toward reflecting the genuine more than the glam.


That's a perfectly acceptable approach for client work, but it may not work for competition.:)

Learn the "rules", play hard, win the game.:D

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-20-2007, 05:31 AM
That's a perfectly acceptable approach for client work, but it may not work for competition.:)

You are probably right...but competition that strives to standardize reality to some arbitrary definition of beauty doesn't motivate me....

Dave_Cisco
01-20-2007, 05:37 AM
You are probably right...but competition that strives to standardize reality to some arbitrary definition of beauty doesn't motivate me....

It's going to be a long row....:)

D._Craig_Flory
01-20-2007, 02:23 PM
You are probably right...but competition that strives to standardize reality to some arbitrary definition of beauty doesn't motivate me....

Hi Sue Ellen;

I'm first going to follow up what Dave said and your response. Masters can do their own thing more than those trying for Master. There is a saying for those who have not yet reached Master: "You must play the game First". In other words, you need to somewhat comform till you get that magic number of 13 image merits. Study merit images, buy one, or more, of the General Collection or Loan Collections books, and continue to ask questioons and learn from people on here.

Holly explained, very well, my reasons for the way I presented the two images. So you know ... the boat was spur of the moment. I wanted a focal point to take the viewers eyes away from the horizontal line of the bridge so I looked for a boat. I ended up using a sample boat that came with one of my versions of Photoshop. I didn't worry about it not being a type boat for that area. And I didn't worry about size either ... just something to illustrate what I was trying to convey.

I deepen and enhance a number of ways. I think I simply used an adjustment layer in levels. But another technique I also use: I make a dupe layer and then select Curves. I click the left hand eye-dropper and click on the most black thing in the image. Many times this is a big help. I will also add another dupe layer and use the right side eye-dropper and click on the whitest thing. And, I will do this is I really need to deepen ... after making a dupe layer I'll bring down the drop down menu in the layers pallete and click on multiply.

For future posts .. look at using a free service like a lot of us do ... Photobucket. Then you will not have to post such small images.

http://photobucket.com/

Dave_Cisco
01-20-2007, 03:45 PM
You are probably right...but competition that strives to standardize reality to some arbitrary definition of beauty doesn't motivate me....

Before I leave this thread, I just wanted to take the opportunity to address this comment in a more sincere way. The comments and guidance given by those individuals critiquing your work are not pulling from "some arbitrary definition of beauty". They are pulling from years of studying the fundamentals of art and it's appeal to the human psyche....it's no more arbitrary than the foundation of music or poetry, although it is equally misunderstood....Balance, color harmony, composition, impact...are real.:)

Holly_Howe
01-20-2007, 04:29 PM
Having not posted the original to compare, you wouldn't know this...but the effect actually softens the shadow. I know the area could be lightened, but I tend to work toward reflecting the genuine more than the glam..

Sue Ellen - I am not refering to softening the shadow. I am refering to the texture that looks like beard stubble. Dark shadows are not necessarily a problem. What does glam have to do with this? I didn't suggest you "reflect the glam". Photographing someone as thier best possible self is not glamming them up. It's drawing out the beauty that is already there. You don't have to photograph someone at their worst for it to be genuine.



Well, it was 8:14 a.m. But the day was already bright.



8:14 is too late for this kind of scene. Try just at sunrise or right before sunset. That's the sweet light time.

In response to David you said "competition that strives to standardize reality to some arbitrary definition of beauty doesn't motivate me" If that's what you truly feel then why do you want to enter? Why did you post images here for possible competition if you aren't motivated to enter? I am puzzled. And why do you jump on that one thing? Nobody said this girl was not a good subject choice. We suggested ways to enhance her personal beauty. Have you ever sat through a whole print competition? Have you ever walked through a whole print show? Yes - images of beautiful females make up part of the prints accepted. But they are not the only photographs that merit or even the majority. If you don't want to enter traditionally beautiful woman then don't. But don't dismiss the whole competition because some images are traditionally attractive women. Don't condem a whole competition because a few of the images entered do not subscribe to your personal beliefs. Heck - if that was the case for not entering - I would have quit long ago when a certain photographer started entering images that portrayed women as - well I can't use those words on this forum. I was offended by what he entered- but I didn't let my views on his work effect what I did for my entries. Since artists first started carving in rocks or putting a brush to canvas, they have wanted to portray the best of the human form. Photographers did not start this idea.

Holly

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-20-2007, 05:26 PM
8:14 is too late for this kind of scene. Try just at sunrise or right before sunset. That's the sweet light time.

Absolutely. I actually stopped to shoot this on our way out of the shoot - we had been in a nearby area for over two hours already...and had decided to leave because of the light. But when I saw the reflection on the way home I had to take it anyway. :)

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-20-2007, 05:29 PM
In response to David you said "competition that strives to standardize reality to some arbitrary definition of beauty doesn't motivate me" If that's what you truly feel then why do you want to enter? Why did you post images here for possible competition if you aren't motivated to enter?

Grin. Who said I wanted to enter? I posted at the goading of D. Craig. It's all his fault. :)

One can always learn and grow from critique, whether it ends up "fitting" them or not. Which is why, yes, I sat through judging and visited the exhibition more than once at HOA.

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-20-2007, 05:46 PM
It's drawing out the beauty that is already there. You don't have to photograph someone at their worst for it to be genuine.


Smile..... now where did that come from, Holly? That you think I mean that one should photograph a subject at their worst in order to be genuine?

You imply this subject looks "her worst" That's what I mean by arbitrary definition. I think she's beautiful. And I suspect this portrayal of her is far from her worst.

I drew out her beauty in the way I saw it; it's simply different from the way you see it. The only difference is, you think you are right. :) I think we just see beauty differently.

I'm going to go get the original image and post the two side by side...I wonder how you would view the original. I don't like it...buy maybe you will.

Forgive the rapid fire responses...we've MISSED you guys!!!

Stan_Lawrence
01-20-2007, 05:56 PM
"but competition that strives to standardize reality to some arbitrary definition of beauty doesn't motivate me...."

The only challenge here is....it's not really arbitrary. Granted, we can see beauty where others don't, that usually comes from more than viewing a face. One of our most important jobs is finding the beauty when it isn't so obvious. I found the baby studies really interesting....where they showed babies (too young to be influenced by society) photos of models and less attractive people. The babies stared at the models, and turned away from others. Beauty is beauty, and that's what it is. As I said, I don't think it's really arbitrary....:cool:

Holly_Howe
01-20-2007, 06:36 PM
Smile..... now where did that come from, Holly? That you think I mean that one should photograph a subject at their worst in order to be genuine?
Well - when it was suugested to improve the lighting and posing, you implied that was glamming them up. So you implied that you aren't willing make any improvements - just be genuine.


You imply this subject looks "her worst" That's what I mean by arbitrary definition. I think she's beautiful. And I suspect this portrayal of her is far from her worst.

I never said this was her worst. I said it is not necessary to photograph someone at their worst in order to be genuine. I was not refering to this girl or this image at all just speaking in general terms. I apolgize if that was not clear.


I drew out her beauty in the way I saw it; it's simply different from the way you see it. The only difference is, you think you are right. :) I think we just see beauty differently.

You are so far off base here it's not even funny. I am not involved in a discussion of what is beautiful and what is not. I have not commented on whether this girl is attractive. Where are you coming from saying I think I am right about what is beautiful? You posted this image under a thread for competition critique. You even asked D. Craig "You don't say how strong or weak these images are in terms of competition. As a first timer I expect to learn a lot. How far away from merit do you think these are?" If that doesn't lead us to assume you were thinking of competition then what were we supposed to think? I wasn't going to post any comments about your images because I knew this was how you would respond, until I saw that question to D. Craig Then I thought - well maybe she really does want to know. So I told you how this image would do in print competition based on my 27 years of experience. Just like you have offered me advice in the past based on your years of experience in an academic field.You didn't like what I had to say - so you defended yourself by accusing us all of having arbitrary standards for beauty. I never said anything about whether this girl was pretty or not. I did mention she was large - but you brought that up first. I do not think that I am right and you are wrong about who is beautiful. I KNOW that I am more educated about what will do well in competition than you are. If you don't want advice and you are going to tell us why we are wrong then don't post images for critique.


I'm going to go get the original image and post the two side by side...I wonder how you would view the original. I don't like it...buy maybe you will.



Why do you think I will like it ? The lighting and posing will be the same. The glasses will still intersect the eyes and the expression will still not be engaging. The problem is not how the judges interpet beauty, as you seem to want to make it. The problem with your image is all those other challenges. Sue Ellen go back and read all the posts. Nobody said she wasn't pretty enough. You are the one who raised that whole issue. Maybe I will like the image better without the texture. But it still won't merit because of those other more important issues. Maybe I should have just been blunt in the first post and just said that this is a technically below average print. You asked D. Craig how far away from merit it is - that's where it's at.

Holly

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-20-2007, 06:37 PM
oh, I'm into research, Stan...don't get me started. ALL kinds of reasons why those babes might have responded as they did...oh, the infinite ways that research can be contaminated...let me get my hands on that study!!!

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-20-2007, 06:54 PM
I wasn't going to post any comments about your images because I knew this was how you would respond,

Respectfully, Holly, I suspect that because you already "know" how I will respond, it decreases your ability to connect to what I'm reallly trying to say. It feels like you doubt me from word one, and base your dialogue with me on that. It isn't condusive to a truly benficial dialogue for either of us. If you could put defensiveness aside and assume that my questioning is simply that...and not personal...

Tell me how I can question you/your views for the sake of dialogue without your taking it personally.

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-20-2007, 06:57 PM
You are so far off base here it's not even funny.

I should have made it green.

I'm not trying to irritate you, Holly, no matter how much you believe that.

D._Craig_Flory
01-20-2007, 07:11 PM
Hi Sue Ellen;

When I was a young photographer, I absorbed all I could at seminars as well as from other photographers. When I got certified in 1986 I still gleaned as much from speakers, and others, as I possibly could. When I got my Craftsman Degree in January 2006 I still wanted to gain all I could.

As I learned I also shared with others. I knew my position and shared accordingly. I would never presume to tell a Master they were wrong. I learn from those above me and share to those who have not yet reached where I am.

I hope you will absorb all that is being shared with you. No one is trying to put you, or your work, down. The images you choose for competition and the way you choose to work those images will hopefully be effected by thoughts and opinions shared with you on here. Holly and Keith don't always agree with my comments or my versions but I take what they say and analyze what they say so I can learn from them. I do hope you will do the same.

Holly_Howe
01-20-2007, 07:20 PM
Tell me how I can question you/your views for the sake of dialogue without your taking it personally.

Hum - You asked for a critique. I gave you one. Then you say I'm taking this all personal. I'm not taking a bit of your comments personally and you can question my views all you want. But that's not what's going on here. You are questioning views I never expressed. You are questioning my standards of beauty which I never referenced. I knew before I posted the first time, you would take ANY negative comments on this particular print as an attack on this girls attractiveness and accuse the commenter of not seeing beauty in all faces etc etc. You are defending this girl against an accusation that NOBODY MADE. I knew in advance that you would jump on that issue and totally ignore the problems with lighting, posing, expression etc. But I thought I'd take a chance and see if I was making a wrong assumption about what you would do. Draw your own conclusions about where the dialogue went. I should have not tried to help and kept my mouth shut. I am not going to respond to this thread anymore. I did not respond the first time because I wanted to be involved in a discussion about female beauty. I responded because I am interested in helping people with print competition. If the thread goes back on topic I'll be glad to join in again. Until then I'm done with this.

Holly

Lori_Clapp
01-20-2007, 09:27 PM
I don't understand why anyone would post an image on this forum, whether for competition or just critique, and then argue with the comments on it. I can understand explaining certain aspects of the image - or why the lighting wasn't quite right, or what you were "trying" to accomplish. But to argue with people's opinions? The people that WE ASK for their opinions!!

If you disagree with an opinion or critique, you have the right to ignore it, but I'm not so sure you have the right to argue it!

Anyway, I would like to thank everyone for the critiques I got on my images. I've been off the forum a lot the past couple of days. I really appreciate all the comments and suggestins I've gotten on the images on this thread, and on the car image I posted on another thread. Even if I don't take every piece of advice offered, I still learn from EVERY critique, and appreciate every one also!

Keith_A_Howe
01-20-2007, 09:32 PM
Lori
Good to hear from you. I began to think that running around playing in the snow in a bikini got the best of you. Oh that was on another thread. Sorry for the hijacking.
Keith

Lori_Clapp
01-20-2007, 09:53 PM
I think this thread was in need of a good hijacking!!

And by the way, you could have at least given us a kleenex to cover up with in the snow - brrrr!

Sue_Ellen_Tuttle
01-20-2007, 10:18 PM
When I was a young photographer, I absorbed all I could at seminars as well as from other photographers. When I got certified in 1986 I still gleaned as much from speakers, and others, as I possibly could. When I got my Craftsman Degree in January 2006 I still wanted to gain all I could.

People have different learning styles. Some learn best by absorbtion, others learn by digging in and picking things apart to see what's underneath or behind. Neither way is superior, it's all about fit. I learn best when I can thoroughly take something apart. I recognize this sometimes irritates people, much to my dismay...but not under my control. It's like my blue eyes and straight hair - it is what it is. What is under my control is using clear, direct language and posting in good faith.


I knew my position and shared accordingly. I would never presume to tell a Master they were wrong. I learn from those above me and share to those who have not yet reached where I am.

hahaha...oh, my. This sounds like you are saying that you accept without question information from those you perceive to be "above" you and offer information not to be questioned by those "below" you. That's not me. I question constantly...masters and rookies alike...it is the way I learn. And - questions help you find out if you are on track and whether you truly understood what is being said.

I also share my views with masters amd rookies alike. I think things get stagnant when the masters are so sacred and the rookies so not-sacred that we can't be ourselves. I am no better - and no worse - than any other participant.

Holly_Howe
01-22-2007, 04:05 AM
If anyone is still reading, please give me your opinions on these, and if you think I should enter them, any title recommendations?

Thank you!!



Finally had time to play a bit. This is an extremely rough job - but you can get the idea. I'm thinking " The Home Place"

Holly

http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p308/imager410/Lorihouse.jpg

Lori_Clapp
01-22-2007, 04:32 AM
Holly, I LOVE it! Now if I can just figure out how to do that. Is it cheating now if I copy you?

Holly_Howe
01-22-2007, 04:35 AM
Holly, I LOVE it! Now if I can just figure out how to do that. Is it cheating now if I copy you?


Lori - when you finally CALL ME like I've been telling you to - I'll tell you how I did it. Pretty simple but I was too impatient to do a good job. Not cheating - you think I ever had an original idea?
holly

Lori_Clapp
01-22-2007, 04:41 AM
I'll call tomorrow - I promise!

I've been trying to keep a low profile after my behavior at Imaging!

DianeDavis
01-22-2007, 05:37 AM
I'll call tomorrow - I promise!

I've been trying to keep a low profile after my behavior at Imaging!

RIIIIGHT


And some more words so it will post

Lori_Clapp
01-22-2007, 05:39 AM
RIIIIGHT


And some more words so it will post

Hahahahhahahahaha.

Holly_Howe
01-24-2007, 12:16 AM
Okay Lori here is another option for the girl - Obviously I did not take the time to blend the girl to the background correctly - but you get the idea. Title is "Time Out"
http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p308/imager410/Lorisgirl.jpg