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JohnMalboeuf
03-29-2008, 10:54 AM
Hi Guys,

There are a lot of great images here for competition. I was talking to a printer about how to finish a print.

Will a matte finish lose the pop required under the competition lights. The printer is new to competition prints and he suggested that I use "Epson Exabition Fiber 13 Mils" paper for the print. I love the way the image looks on this paper. It appears to hold up well and seems to be scratch resistant. He is suggesting that we do not coat the print.

What are your thoughts coating or no coating?

Should I go with a Matte or a more traditional glossy finish for competition?

Will it hurt my chances of a good score if the print is not glossy?

John

Jane_Lydick_Staid
03-29-2008, 01:30 PM
Hi John,

Glossy paper makes the image pop under the lights. There are no rules that say you have to use it, but it's much better.

Good luck.

D._Craig_Flory
03-29-2008, 02:07 PM
[QUOTE=JohnMalboeuf;142578]Hi Guys,

There are a lot of great images here for competition. I was talking to a printer about how to finish a print.

Hi John;

A matte surface image will die under the mini-spots. The best has always been hi-gloss paper and hi-gloss lacquer. That will give you the best color, saturation, and detail.

Mark_Levesque
03-29-2008, 02:16 PM
I have seen some matte papers pop when coated. The images seem to have real depth. I think one could do well with such papers on the right images because they would be different and therefore stand out more. Not every image is intended to have huge DMAX, contrast and saturation. If you pick the types of images well you could get results you are really happy with. Your best best, IMO, is to replicate competition lighting and see how some test prints look. You may start a new trend.

Keith_A_Howe
03-29-2008, 02:44 PM
Holly and I both have several merit prints on watercolor paper. I had a loan print on it two years ago. That's about as matte as you can get. It's a matter of the right surface for the right image. If we are talking about your sports images I would definately go high gloss. Matte paper works better on an image portraying softness, either in emotion or actual texture of the subject matter, like the petal of a rose or a curve of a baby's cheek. For the excitment of your sports stuff I would stay high gloss.

On a side note, my comp prints arrived a couple days ago. They are F surface, no spray and NO laminate. I am very happy with that choice.

Keith

Linda_Gregory
03-29-2008, 03:03 PM
GAAAAH!!! You've got yours back and I've started THINKING about mine! Gotta getta MOVE on.

Had a few things on my mind recently, you know?

Cheri_MacCallum
03-29-2008, 03:40 PM
From my experience judging and entering myself, the matte finish can work if your image is a high to medium high key (lighter images). I entered a higher key image of a polaroid manipulation on matte fine art paper and it did well. But with the darker low key images, the shaded side to shadow areas go really flat under the lights. I have lacquered the matte papers with glossy and it give is a really nice luminous glow kinda like old fiber paper.

MarilynDillon
03-29-2008, 04:07 PM
Hi John - This is my first year at NHPPA comp too - so have decided to go more traditional and do the high gloss thing - I am afraid to experiment just yet.

John_Metcalfe
03-29-2008, 04:16 PM
I agree with Keith. I have a few images that made it matte. But it's usually the art piece that will pull it off.

JohnMalboeuf
03-29-2008, 06:10 PM
Hi Guys,

Thanks for the input. I know some of you have seen this image.

http://www.johnmphoto.com/images/mayIhelpYOU3_lr.jpg

Based on what I see above I think I should stick with the glossy. It does look great on the Matte Paper. Maybe Matt for Client image and Glossy for competition?

Thanks again,
John

John_Metcalfe
03-29-2008, 06:16 PM
yep! you got it!

Noelle_Zaleski
03-29-2008, 06:24 PM
oooh I really like that shot!! The eagle has such a look in his eyes. What will you name it?

Mark_Levesque
03-29-2008, 07:56 PM
Are you talkin' to me?

Linda_Gregory
03-29-2008, 07:58 PM
So everyone's abandoning lamination, right--and going with straight glossy paper?

Makes it much easier on us labtypes. :p

JohnMalboeuf
03-29-2008, 08:05 PM
Hi Guys,

I am thinking of going with the title "Follow Me" for the print.

The hawk looks like a kind old man, but with a dark side.

John

Noelle_Zaleski
03-29-2008, 09:21 PM
Are you talkin' to me?

umm, i don't think so:p

Noelle_Zaleski
03-29-2008, 09:24 PM
Hi Guys,

I am thinking of going with the title "Follow Me" for the print.

The hawk looks like a kind old man, but with a dark side.

John

John, it's a great shot!! I wish you good luck!

What about "Follow me to the dark side"

Rick_Massarini
03-30-2008, 06:28 AM
So everyone's abandoning lamination, right--and going with straight glossy paper?

Makes it much easier on us labtypes. :p

I will not be laminating any more of my competition prints. I'll print them on F paper fresh for the competition and if they get scratched - so be it ! The lamination caused a graying of the blacks in the images that I sent in to SWPPA. I didn't compare the unlaminated prints to the laminated ones until after the convention, but once I did, the laminated prints had a definite grayer tone in the blacks than the unlaminated one. In fact, the black matting around one of the images was set to maximum density in PS and the print was printed down to competition density - and after it was laminated, the black mat was grey on the laminated print but a good black on the uncoated one. I kind of looked like prints from years ago that we lacquer sprayed in our New Orleans 200+% humidity - some of you may remember that slight blush that would ocurr when moisture got trapped in the lacquer becasuse you didn't add enough retarder...
I'll still have client work laminated for protection, but I think I'm going to give it up on the competition stuff.

Keith_A_Howe
03-30-2008, 06:29 PM
I will not be laminating any more of my competition prints.

FINALLY! A convert! I have been saying this for three years but nobody would listen to me!
Rick, should we form a 12 step group for laminators anonymous?
Keith

Jackie_Haggerty
03-30-2008, 08:45 PM
Dude- I've been with ya! :) (ok, ok, at least the last 10 months or so!) :)

Keith_A_Howe
03-31-2008, 12:00 AM
Yea thats true! Sorry I didn't include you.:)

Jackie_Haggerty
03-31-2008, 12:12 AM
It's ok- just wanted to make sure you have a support system for your 12 step program group! :D

I don't know what step I am on though! LOL

Rick_Massarini
03-31-2008, 03:57 AM
FINALLY! A convert! I have been saying this for three years but nobody would listen to me!
Rick, should we form a 12 step group for laminators anonymous?
Keith

I never really noticed the graying before - until I looked at one of my prints under the lights and couldn't find a good black anywhere on it. The image on the print must have been great because the print really wasn't. When I compared it to the unlaminated print back in the studio, I took all 12 steps all at once because the unlaminated print popped and the laminated one just didn't !!! For competition, I really don't care how the print comes back to me as long as it makes it throught the first few days of the judging - I'll have it reprinted for the studio wall if it gets scratched. It's kind of a shock to realize now, in retrospect, that one of the reasons why some of my entries may not have merited was that extra cost protective lamination that was supposed to add snap, but did exactly the opposite!
I'm a convert - Praise the Lord !!!!

Ben_Leavitt
05-09-2008, 07:44 PM
Hey everyone,

This is going to be my first year entering and I've been told that laminating is the way to go, but apparently a few of you think otherwise. :confused:

What kind of coating are you using on your prints? Is it the UV coating my lab offers or something else?

I want extremely shiny, saturated colors, and very dark blacks.
I'm actually thinking about using Metallic paper as well.

Any suggestions?

D._Craig_Flory
05-09-2008, 08:11 PM
Hi Ben;

I always take them into my spray booth and use Hi-Gloss Lacquer. (I use Sureguard)

There is a big problem using metallic paper. The blacks usually don't come out looking black. If you try it, first get an 8x10 to see how it looks under judging light conditions.

Linda_Gregory
05-09-2008, 08:20 PM
Metallic looks black, no problem as long as your lab knows what it's doing. It does take a chemistry tweak to get it black but it's not that hard and oh, when done right, with the right image, Metallic looks great.

I have been told that it doesn't look metallic when the lights shine on it but I did merit a metallic image last year.

I use Fuji Gloss paper and do not spray. Last year I laminated and did get the milky affect so I bought more glossy paper (it takes a similar chemistry tweak) and did them all that way this year. At our HOA, I had two merits and two more from other customers and ALL had good print quality comments.

Keith_A_Howe
05-09-2008, 09:27 PM
What kind of coating are you using on your prints?
I sent raw prints (no spray, no coating, no lamination) to HOA. They scored ok.

Keith

Linda_Gregory
05-09-2008, 09:51 PM
Ok??? Are you Mr Understatement today???

He cleaned house!

JohnMalboeuf
05-10-2008, 01:54 AM
I sent raw prints (no spray, no coating, no lamination) to HOA. They scored ok.

Keith

OK????? 96 at NHPPA a few weeks ago. Awesome print by the way.

I used a gloss finish at NHPPA of 4 of the 5 prints (2 blues, 2 reds). The 5th was an uncoated print that scored the deaded 79.

John

Michael_Gan
05-10-2008, 03:00 AM
When we talked about Gloss vs. Matte, it really had to do with Matte Sprays which really cut down on the print quality under the lights, thus the standard of gloss was born.

I've been playing with the new Baryta Papers and they look so much like the old air-dried F papers. They have this natural "gloss" to them that I hope the judges will like. My lungs will be quite happy if they do;)