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DianeDavis
02-29-2008, 03:08 AM
'k Getting ready to send a case.

These are a couple of recent clients that I was working on, anything here?

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h190/prophotog/Sadie05.jpg

Not that it matters for comp, but this guy was one that I advocated for when he was 5. At that time he used a wheelchair and he had some problems with the school. He spent hours at home because of his disability. He became facinated with magic and is pretty good now. It was a lot of fun to do his senior portraits and see how far he has come- and that he now is not dependant on a wheelchair.

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h190/prophotog/DSC_0069r.jpg


http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h190/prophotog/DSC_0058.jpg



Sorry- I tried to make them smaller- and it didn't work :(

Joe_Galioto
02-29-2008, 03:02 PM
diane,
a few problems with all three.
#1 a view into the armpit is never attractive.
#2 pose looks ackward, chin tucked down & fingers cut off at bottom
& jacket sloppy.
#3 lighting on face needs more luminasity, shadow running down shirt &
the chin tucked down distorts jaw line and makes him look weak.

wish i could've been more positive
joe

DianeDavis
02-29-2008, 04:17 PM
Thanks Joe.

After 71 views, I guess that is all anyone has to say.

Keith_A_Howe
02-29-2008, 04:20 PM
Diane,

I think you have fallen into that classic mistake we all make, becoming emotionally involved with your subject. Because you know the young man and the challenges he has faced, you can't be objective. I would skip both of those images as far as entering. The young lady can be improved and I am showing how I would present her. The PS work is poor because of the low res file, but what I did was crop to get rid of the problem armpit, flipped to improve composition, enhanced the eyes to make them pop more, added a catchlight to the partial hair covered eye and liquified the corners of her mouth slightly to change it from a grouchy expression to a solemn one. I didn't address the dark circles under her eyes but that needs attention also.
http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p308/imager410/dianegirl-1.jpg

With these changes done on a full res file I think you could maybe be in the above average catergory. Without seeing a higher res file or the actual print I am hesitant to think it could go any higher.
Keith

Keith_A_Howe
02-29-2008, 04:21 PM
I was typing as you were making your last post Diane

DianeDavis
02-29-2008, 04:29 PM
Thanks Keith!

As always, you come to the rescue.

Joe_Galioto
02-29-2008, 04:35 PM
keith,
an amazing transformation!
joe

Teya_Rutherford
02-29-2008, 04:59 PM
I think you've received great advice. Can you show a few more choices?

Mark_Levesque
02-29-2008, 05:03 PM
Ah, the picture within the picture. Great job of distilling, Keith.

DianeDavis
02-29-2008, 05:12 PM
Yep. I felt like that one had something- and was not there, so glad that Keith is on this forum. And I knew that I was probably too close to the others to be objective- too bad you can't tell the story ;).

I'll look for some others later.

D._Craig_Flory
02-29-2008, 05:25 PM
We can all take something else from what Keith did with that image. When you look at a scene, or potential spot, look past the overall area and look for a spot within the spot. There may be a merit spot you are not utilizing simply because it's right beside the highway with trash strewn about. Move in, use depth of field and depth of focus to also help control what will show in an image.

The same goes with a pose. Try it the way you envisioned it. Then try it in a vertical if horizontal or vice versa. Try moving farther away or closer.

Keith_A_Howe
02-29-2008, 05:29 PM
keith,
an amazing transformation!
joe


Ah, the picture within the picture. Great job of distilling, Keith.

Well, this is one time I can't accept the credit. I looked at these last night but didn't have time to comment because a couple people had emailed me images and I was working on them. So today I showed these to Holly and said I didn't think there was anything there. She agreed on the guy but showed me her version of the girl. The only thing I actually contributed was liquifing the corners of the mouth. The rest was all Holly . . . but then she has had a good teacher!:D

Keith

DianeDavis
02-29-2008, 06:08 PM
Holly is my favorite ;).

DianeDavis
02-29-2008, 06:54 PM
I know the diaper is an issue in this one-

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h190/prophotog/Baker_79.jpg

And you've seen this one before-

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h190/prophotog/DSC_0018-1.jpg

Stan_Lawrence
02-29-2008, 07:18 PM
Diane, let's try a slightly different way of working here....kind of a take off on jazz education. We teach students to play along with a solo, learn it note for note. Get all the articulations, the feeling, learn the language by imitation....and then they can create their own solos......we can do the same thing in photography. Find some loan images that you think are spectacular, and imitate them in a practice session. Keep at it until you can duplicate what they did. It will require you to really analyze the pose, the light, everything. If you do that enough times, you will have developed a lot of the skills, in addition to your eye. You can then take those skills and start creating your own loan images.....if this makes no sense, let me know and I'll delete the post....:cool:

Mark_Levesque
02-29-2008, 07:40 PM
It does make sense, Stan, but even if Diane didn't get it, it would make no sense to delete the post because others might.

D._Craig_Flory
02-29-2008, 07:41 PM
Hi Diane;

Here is another approach for the elderly gentleman. I call it "Worn Down by Time". I hope it helps you see some possibilities.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i93/DC47/WornDownbyTime.jpg

Stan_Lawrence
02-29-2008, 07:46 PM
"it would make no sense to delete the post because others might."

Precisely my point, thanks. :cool:

Keith_A_Howe
02-29-2008, 07:48 PM
"it would make no sense to delete the post because others might."

Precisely my point, thanks. :cool:

If that was your point, why did you offer to delete it?

Stan_Lawrence
02-29-2008, 07:50 PM
"If that was your point, why did you offer to delete it?"

Exactly. You guys are way too sharp for me....:cool:

ps Keith, love the upcoming commitments.....;)

DianeDavis
02-29-2008, 08:14 PM
Diane, let's try a slightly different way of working here....kind of a take off on jazz education. We teach students to play along with a solo, learn it note for note. Get all the articulations, the feeling, learn the language by imitation....and then they can create their own solos......we can do the same thing in photography. Find some loan images that you think are spectacular, and imitate them in a practice session. Keep at it until you can duplicate what they did. It will require you to really analyze the pose, the light, everything. If you do that enough times, you will have developed a lot of the skills, in addition to your eye. You can then take those skills and start creating your own loan images.....if this makes no sense, let me know and I'll delete the post....:cool:

I will do that, thanks for the advice. And I understand from this post that I am not ready to enter competition yet. Ok, a year of practicing here I come. Thanks Stan, I do appreciate your time- I honestly do.

DianeDavis
02-29-2008, 08:29 PM
Hi Diane;

Here is another approach for the elderly gentleman. I call it "Worn Down by Time". I hope it helps you see some possibilities.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i93/DC47/WornDownbyTime.jpg



Thanks Craig for taking the time to do this version. I have so much to learn about competition and am just starting, so I appreciate any help I can get!!

I do like this version.

Keith_A_Howe
03-01-2008, 03:39 AM
I. And I understand from this post that I am not ready to enter competition yet. .
Well that's just silly. Of course you are ready. There have been many photographers on this forum who have entered prints with way less experience and talent then you . . . and they all lived to tell about it.
Keith

DianeDavis
03-01-2008, 03:57 AM
Well that's just silly. Of course you are ready. There have been many photographers on this forum who have entered prints with way less experience and talent then you . . . and they all lived to tell about it.
Keith

LMAO!!!

Perfect end to this day. Thank you, Keith. :D

btw, I think that puts me in the "no choice but enter or you are a loser" catagory.

Andrea_Chapelo
03-01-2008, 12:35 PM
Hey Diane...read my signature...see, you are smarter than me, so if I can do it you can too:D

Mark_Levesque
03-01-2008, 01:04 PM
I agree with Keith. It's not a matter of you not being ready. It's a matter of becoming educated in how to select your best images and present them. Forget the back story on all of them, and just look at the images. Lighting, posing, and expression. I'm sure you have images that are suitable for print competition. I have seen them.

Ron_Jackson
03-01-2008, 01:12 PM
Diane I didn't really feel ready either but at the urging by many here, I stepped out and entered. It's the process of getting there that is so valuable. I have learned a lot and now I better understand why competing is worthwhile. I have second guessed myself to death on what to submit but in the end, I learned from every single image I worked with to get ready. You have the skills and the images, just get in there and tweak a few to fill a case and you will also learn so much in the process. Join me, another first timer and have some fun. You can do this.

Cassandra_Sullivan
03-01-2008, 01:36 PM
Re: Keith/Holly's take on the image - when my prints were critiqued last weekend by one of the judges, his issue with my 2 portraits was cropping - when he showed me how he'd crop in tighter, he said "this is the story" - the other 'stuff' didn't contribute to the "story". So what Keith/Holly basically illustrated was the girl's face/expression was the story, and her arms over her head didn't contribute to that story, so they should be cropped out.
That's one of my challenges - finding the 'story' in an image for competition. I like to think I captured it in-camera just perfect. ;) So Diane, enter your prints - and get a one-on-one critique afterwards - it can only help! It definitely helped me. Plus it's really exciting waiting for your prints to come up during the competition (no matter how they do!)

DianeDavis
03-01-2008, 08:47 PM
Thanks Ron, Mark and Cassandra,
I appreciate your kind words and gentle urging. I'll get Zack right on it ;).

Seriously, I think maybe I'll do some photography in the next couple of weeks using all I've learned and see what I come up with.

Keith_A_Howe
03-01-2008, 11:46 PM
Diane - I like the tighter crop but don't flip the print of the older gentleman. Then you read into the back of his head and get stopped and when you do move on the lighting pattern just pulls you right out of the print. Leave it the way you had it reading into his face. If that spot on his forehead is blown out - you could crop it even tighter and present it horziontally.
Keith

Michael_Gan
03-02-2008, 04:04 PM
Hey Diane, Western States and PPC's print competition was last month. Where are you sending your case?