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Lori_Clapp
02-25-2008, 05:46 PM
Okay, Now that they have been judged, here are my prints and the scores....

(They were judged by Dachowskis and Howes, and Thomas Henn from Colorado)

Belly Laugh - 77
http://www.amomentintime2.com/public/12039649986691_belly laugh.jpg

Broke before Dawn - 82
http://www.amomentintime2.com/public/12039650244958_brokeb4dawn.jpg

Hot Time in the Old Town Tonight - 80
http://www.amomentintime2.com/public/12039650554849_hot time.jpg

Morning Light - 77
http://www.amomentintime2.com/public/12039650867567_Morning light.jpg

D._Craig_Flory
02-25-2008, 06:09 PM
Hi Lori;

Way to go !!! Two out of four ... next time go for three or even four out of four. Each time you get more experience and knowledge.

Andrea_Chapelo
02-25-2008, 06:16 PM
Yay Lori!
Nice stuff. Thanks for posting your images and scores. I always find that helpful.
Broke before dawn is awesome!

JohnHeckler
02-25-2008, 09:41 PM
Congrats Lori! 2 out of 4 is an EXCELLENT result and if I do THAT well at MES, I will be tickled silly and lucky as heck.

What comments, if any, did the judges make when the prints were on the turntable?

Don_Chick
02-25-2008, 10:02 PM
Congratulations, that's great news!

Cheri_MacCallum
02-25-2008, 10:33 PM
Congratulations Lori!!!

Ron_Jackson
02-25-2008, 10:38 PM
Congrats Lori. Feels really good huh? Way to go.

JohnMalboeuf
02-25-2008, 11:31 PM
Great Job, Congratulations.

John

DiannaAllen
02-25-2008, 11:38 PM
Congrats Lori! :D I'm still waiting to hear how mine did.:p

andiegoodman
02-26-2008, 12:27 AM
Way to go, Lori. Congratulations.

Valerie_Harte
02-26-2008, 12:31 AM
Congrats Lori... Dianna... have you found out your resluts yet? If not I can shed some light on a few for you- through PM of course so you can share yourself.

Cindi_K_McDaniel
02-26-2008, 12:33 AM
Wow, 2 & 3 are just blowing me away!

Heather_L._Smith
02-26-2008, 01:23 AM
Great job, Lori! How do YOU feel??

Valerie_Kieselhorst
02-26-2008, 01:34 AM
Great great great Lori! Thank you for sharing the results!
You should be more confident in yourself now!

bob_hancock
02-26-2008, 02:07 AM
Congratulations!!!!

Charlotte_Dameron
02-26-2008, 02:36 AM
awesome! I love Broke before Dawn!!

Congratulations

Karen_Linsley
02-26-2008, 03:54 PM
that is awesome Lori! I'm so happy for you!

Marc_Benjamin
02-26-2008, 07:03 PM
Yey! Yey! Yey!

DiannaAllen
02-26-2008, 09:38 PM
Congrats Lori... Dianna... have you found out your resluts yet? If not I can shed some light on a few for you- through PM of course so you can share yourself.

No but I'll just wait till my friend returns my case tomorrow. I'm sure he has not called because he wants to surprise me. It's killing me not knowing but he's the one that got me into this profession and if he wants to deliver the news in person I'll respect him for it. At least that better be why he has not called! He does not have a clue I have contacts with you guys that could tell me. I won't let him know I know anything (at least for now) ;)

Thanks for the offer though I've waited this long so one more day won't kill me.

Don_Chick
02-26-2008, 10:05 PM
Thanks for the offer though I've waited this long so one more day won't kill me.

But it's about to kill me.... what's his number? :eek: :D

Lori_Clapp
02-27-2008, 02:18 AM
Thanks for the comments everyone. Someone asked how I feel about the results. I feel good about them because I actually did better than I expected to. I figured they were all in the 77-79 range, if not lower. I thought Belly Laugh would do better than it did.

John - as for the comments from the judges - most of my issues were with print quality. The whites were not white enough in Belly Laugh. In Broke Before Dawn, the blacks weren't black enough. The judges said it kind of had a cut out feel to it, and some thought I may have added the moon, which I didn't. No comments on Morning Light - but i knew that was a pretty weak one.

The fire image - they gave me suggestions on better cropping - although without Linda Gregory's advice on the cropping I used, I doubt that it would have merited at all (thanks Linda!!)

Keith suggested I may want to crop out the sky - so I will try that and post it for comments.

For the people who helped me out in picking my images - thank you very much!

And for those who haven't entered, or don't want to enter, you really need to. It's a great way to learn, and it's fun whether you win or not. Losing doesn't hurt, and it's not emberassing, because you always learn what you can do to become better. And the more entries there are - the more fun it is!

Lori_Clapp
02-27-2008, 01:08 PM
Bumping this back up so hopefully Keith will comment on my images (now that he's home) and give me advice for Nationals

Justin_Pearson
02-27-2008, 01:52 PM
Congratulations Lori, your images are stunning!

Keith_A_Howe
02-27-2008, 04:28 PM
I have ok'd this with Lori. We thought maybe this was a unique opportunity to see her prints and what they scored and then hear from a couple people that actually judged them as to why we scored them where we did. Hopefully when Jeff and Carolle get home they will add their two cents.

Belly laugh - The panel chuckled when we saw the print, that's always a good thing. The main issue here was print quality. It doesn't show up on my moniter but when we actually saw the print it was muddy and had an almost yellow cast. The whites of his eyes looked like he had jaundice. There just wasn't any "snap" to the print. That can be corrected (and will be corrected right Lori?) By enhancing the tonality of this print it will have dimension. It just was flat under the lights. It also needs some further enhancement to the boys eyes. Right now there are several strong elements that are competing for our attention, the belly, the open laughing mouth and the boys eyes. By working up his eyes they will become the one strong center of interest and force the other elements to become supporting "cast" to this story. The title was perfect. I did DQ myself from scoring this print as I knew Lori was the maker.

Broke Before Dawn - Holly didn't get the title until she went up and looked at it closely. Seems like it would be obvious that this was Las Vegas but you have to remember we see the print first from 6 feet away. The strength of this print was that it was tack sharp. Every tiny building was crisp when you looked at the print close up. And if I am remembering correctly the blacks were good rich blacks. What kept the print from going higher was the main building in the center of the print is tipping over to the right. Even though this a fish eye there should be a true vertical in the center of the print. Again Lori can correct this with cropping befire she reprints for National. We also would like to see it positioned on the board differently - probably higher. The judges were mixed on whether the moon needed to dissapear or not.

Hot Time in the Old Town Tonight - Hope Lori doesn't mind if I say but this was a borderline 80. I believe that it did not merit in scoring but went in thumbs up and actually Holly and I were against the print. There were some issues in the sky with noise in the IMO too heavily vignetted corners. Also the cropping could be improved. I am including my ideas for cropping to show how the image can be made more impactful. The title was great but did not work when we saw the obviously daytime sky. Now that I have eliminated the sky, I think the title will work better. By leaving a sliver of the building on the left it balances the building on the right, creates a stopper to keep you in the image and frame the aerial truck and it also allows that aerial to be at the thirds.
http://i131.photobucket.com/albums/p308/imager410/HotTime.jpg

Morning Light - Lot's of great stuff in this image - but what is it a photograph of? First off we are blocked out of the scene by the fence. Then once we get over the hurdle of that fence, what are we supposed to be looking at? A house? a flag pole? the coast line? We are going to suggest Lori crops off the fence at the bottom and the house so that the flag is about 1/3 in from the right side of the image. Then snap up the light on the flag to make it the strongest visual draw in the image. Then the title would be "Reveille". There are some other possibilities of how to present this image - but this would be our first suggestion to try. The print quality was alos an issue - it was muddy and needed to be snapped up. In Lori's defense she sent the prints to the lab and asked them to print them like they do mine for competition. Lori did not know that I do all my own adjustments and order the cheapest straight print available.

Also Lori did not tell you guys she got a Top Ten print award.

Keith

Lori_Clapp
02-27-2008, 06:04 PM
Also Lori did not tell you guys she got a Top Ten print award.

Keith

Maybe because she's not exactly sure what that means, lol!

Thanks for the comments on these Keith. You are right - the fire print scored a 79 - I think it was challenged at that time and stayed at 79, and then when it came back for thumbs up, it went up to 80.

I probably will not enter "morning light" at Nationals. I will try to find something I like better. It was kind of there just to fill my print case - it wasn't one of my favorites.

It was good to have my prints judged by the people from the forum who have been helping me, without them knowing they were mine! It showed me for sure that the critiques they give me on the forum are not watered down to keep from hurting my feelings - they are very honest with how they think an image will do.

Lori_Clapp
02-27-2008, 06:04 PM
Thank you Justin - I just saw your post. :)

DianeDavis
02-27-2008, 06:12 PM
Congrats Lori! And Thank You for sharing your prints so the rest of us can learn.

And Keith, again, you so generously give. Thank You.

Keith_A_Howe
02-27-2008, 06:16 PM
It was good to have my prints judged by the people from the forum who have been helping me, without them knowing they were mine! It showed me for sure that the critiques they give me on the forum are not watered down to keep from hurting my feelings - they are very honest with how they think an image will do.


We are not that nice and besides we don't like you enough to care about your feelings.;)

Keith

Linda_Gregory
02-27-2008, 06:48 PM
Lori,

CONGRATULATIONS!!!

We've been nuts here with the impending move and I'm taking a short break between packing, draining the Kreonite and agonizing over other issues.

Am so glad you learned so much from this...as did we, the observers.

I am about flat out of inspiration right now and wondering if I'll even enter this year. *sigh*






Did I say that outloud????

KristiSanger
02-27-2008, 10:08 PM
And for those who haven't entered, or don't want to enter, you really need to. It's a great way to learn, and it's fun whether you win or not. Losing doesn't hurt, and it's not emberassing, because you always learn what you can do to become better. And the more entries there are - the more fun it is!

1st off WAY TO GO!!! and second, that's me. I guess I just need to buck up and get some entered. I am kinda freaked out about the specs though. Like how to crop stuff, the case, mounting etc. Not to mention trying to choose a few images. *sigh*

Thanks for sharing and great images, broke before dawn gave me a good chuckle.

Kristi Sanger
KS Photogrpahy

Lori_Clapp
02-27-2008, 10:14 PM
We are not that nice and besides we don't like you enough to care about your feelings.;)

Keith

Well then I'd like to see what you would do for me if you DID like me! Lol

Keith_A_Howe
02-27-2008, 10:18 PM
Well then I'd like to see what you would do for me if you DID like me! Lol

Be afraid . . . be very afraid!

Lori_Clapp
02-27-2008, 10:35 PM
Be afraid . . . be very afraid!

Now where have I heard that before??

StaceyDamon
02-27-2008, 10:39 PM
Yeah for you Lori, Congrats!!!

Joe_Galioto
02-27-2008, 11:12 PM
lori congradulations,
because of the coments regarding print quality, maybe you should be considering a different lab. the right lab could make the differance in this case. unless of couse if you printed them in house?
joe

Keith_A_Howe
02-27-2008, 11:12 PM
Now where have I heard that before??

Well . . . you won't be able to say we didn't warn you.

keith

Keith_A_Howe
02-27-2008, 11:18 PM
lori congradulations,
because of the coments regarding print quality, maybe you should be considering a different lab. the right lab could make the differance in this case. unless of couse if you printed them in house?
joe

It was not a lab issue. Lori uses the same lab as I do and I went 4 for 4 with two loan last year. It was more a communication issue. Because Lori is fairly new to competition she didn't quite ask for the right thing and didn't quite prep the files correctly. Sorry Lori no disrespect intended to you, but we both use the same great lab and I don't want them to get blamed for something that was not their fault.

Keith

Lori_Clapp
02-28-2008, 03:29 AM
Joe, Keith is right - I just recently switched to ACI Lab and I am very happy with them. My mistake was that I rushed my prints to get them ready and instead of doing my part to make sure they would print well for competition, I left it up to the lab but told them to print them like they print comp prints for Keith Howe. Well, i should have checked with Keith first, because he gets his prints ready himself, then has them printed exactly as he has prepared them. So the lab printed my prints exactly as I had prepared them, which wasn't at all!

So it was totally my fault - not my labs fault at all.

Keith - no problem-o.

Keith_A_Howe
02-28-2008, 03:47 AM
In case you were wondering, Lori really does have a big, BIG head and a tiny body! She doesn't wear those glasses anymore though. . . she musta had Lasik. Oh and did I mention here middle name is Bobble?:)
Keith

Heather_L._Smith
02-28-2008, 12:28 PM
Well, i should have checked with Keith first, because he gets his prints ready himself, then has them printed exactly as he has prepared them. So the lab printed my prints exactly as I had prepared them, which wasn't at all!

Oh my heck, Lori... that is too funny!!! I mean, it isn't, but it is!! Well, at least you know they follow directions, huh? Hehe.

D._Craig_Flory
02-28-2008, 12:34 PM
Given the direction this thread has taken about labs, I offer this:

What I usually do is this. After totally preparing comp. images I upload, and order, an 8X10 or 10X8 file of each. When I get them back, I review them under the same intensity as judging lights. If they look good I then upload the full size files and order the 16X20's & 20X16's on gatorfoam. If any are off in density and / or color balance I open the .psd file(s) and re-work them. By doing it like this I only invest a couple dollars till I know they are perfect. I hope this helps.

Lori_Clapp
02-28-2008, 12:50 PM
Given the direction this thread has taken about labs, I offer this:

What I usually do is this. After totally preparing comp. images I upload, and order, an 8X10 or 10X8 file of each. When I get them back, I review them under the same intensity as judging lights. If they look good I then upload the full size files and order the 16X20's & 20X16's on gatorfoam. If any are off in density and / or color balance I open the .psd file(s) and re-work them. By doing it like this I only invest a couple dollars till I know they are perfect. I hope this helps.

D. Craig, thanks for the suggestion, but for most of us, that would only work if they had "hourly" shipping back and forth to and from the lab, since I had to pay to have mine overnighted since I waited til the VERY last minute. But yeah, for normal people, i suppose your method would make sense lol! (I learned all I know about entering comp from Keith - so I guess it's his fault that I wait til the last minute). And yes I do wear those glasses - the room was dark when he was speaking so he didn't see me put them on.

Linda_Gregory
02-28-2008, 01:00 PM
I print at least 8 x 10 samples of mine. (giggle)

Can't tell you how cool it was to get my video critique last year and have Mark Garber actually comment on the great print quality and he didn't even KNOW I'm a lab!!

Keith_A_Howe
02-28-2008, 01:51 PM
(I learned all I know about entering comp from Keith - so I guess it's his fault that I wait til the last minute).
Hey, it's always worked for me. I like living on the edge!
Keith

Jeff_Dachowski
03-02-2008, 02:12 AM
Hi Lori,
Too bad we didn't have a chance to meet at the convention. Maybe Phoenix?

I thought I would give you an idea of how I scored your prints. I have not read any of Keith's critiques, so when we say the same thing, I can chalk it up to my keen eye, and brilliant sense of color and complete understanding of composition, not plagarism! :) Heres hoping he wrote the same thing!!

Belly Laugh- I scored this a 78 mostly for the priceless expression on this little boy's face. What kept me out of the merit category was the print quality. The image was printed or modified to be flat. Another issue for me was that the hand is not connected to any part of the boy. Maybe a lower crop would result in another curve? Maybe place the hand closer to the face, and crop vertically or square?

Broke before Dawn - Great title!! I scored this one initially a 79. I had some concerns with the vertical lines, ( although I couldn't put my finger on it until someone said it!), and lack of detail in the sky. Overall I loved the sharpness of the image. It made me want to look all around and hunt for things I could recognize. If you were to shoot this again, try to make the image a bit earlier in the evening to give just a touch of color to the sky.

Hot time in the old town tonight- I scored this an 80. I spoke of maybe cropping the power lines out in the horizon, and am not really sure if that makes it stronger or not. Also the trees in the foreground are really out, and maybe it might be better to crop up on them just a bit higher.

Morning light- I scored this image a 78. I think there is a beautiful image here if adjusted correctly. I love the leading lines, the mist on the trees, the natural blocks that are in place on the edge of the image. Maybe by removing a chunk from the middle it could compress the composition to be a bit more dynamic. Also this print was just too dark even under the lights.

Hope this helps.

Jeff

Lori_Clapp
03-02-2008, 02:36 AM
Jeff - were you at my convention? There were so many people I must have missed you. Your comments would have been more helpful if they had come a week sooner. Lol. They really do help - and yes, you and Keith both mentioned most of the same things. I am going to work on some of them for Nationals, but I think I will probably replace at least one of them, if not two.